Our obsession with what is normal and acceptable is at the heart of how we view mental health. It is also the source of stigma around many forms of mental illness.

In this podcast with anthropology professor, Richard Grinker, we ask how do we fix it? What are successful ways to challenge stigmas, as we help millions of people reach their full potential? Richard discusses the findings in his uplifting new book, "Nobody's Normal: How Culture Created the Stigma of Mental Illness."

Social distancing, remote learning, and disruption of social supports during the COVID pandemic are likely to lead to an even greater crisis of mental illness. But Richard sees hope at this moment. "The pandemic provides us with an opportunity to make progress in destigmatizing mental illness," he tells us.

Though the legacies of shame and secrecy are still with us today, Richard says that we are at the cusp of ending the marginalization of the mentally ill. In the twenty-first century, mental illnesses are fast becoming a more accepted and visible part of human diversity. We discuss his groundbreaking reserch.

Recommendation: Richard has just and much enjoyed "The Quiet Americans: Four CIA Spies at the Dawn of the Cold War — a Tragedy in Three Acts", by Scott Anderson.